Overlanding with Dragoman
Category: Dragoman | July 4, 2007 By ModeratorDragoman is considered to be an expensive but highly reputable overlanding company. Is the high cost justified considering recent reports of poorly managed trips, unjustifiable kitty increases and a discount structure which leaves a lot to be desired?
Would you pay a premium based on reputation?.
A lot of valid points made both for and against Dragoman’s operations and as a past passenger I did have some positive experiences with them. But I would also argue that even if Dragoman’s trucks are more reliable, as far as electrics are concerned anyway, and therefore more easily fixed if a breakdown occurs, customers are still paying too much for what the company offers in comparison to other overlanding companies. Especially if you consider that it certainly can’t cost more to maintain an existing fleet from cheaply available cannibalised spares than having to fork out hundreds of thousands of pounds to completely replace a fleet with new trucks, like many overlanding firms that charge customers less have done in recent years.
Personally, as a veteran of overland trips with several companies I can say the following:
1. A lot depends on the quality of the crew. If you are unfortunate enough to get a driver who is a heavy drinker, and from my experience the overland crew community does spend a lot of its spare time in bars, then you’d be right to complain. This sort of problem and others, happens across all overlanding companies, so it really is pot luck what crew you get and how good they are, e.g. how experienced, how knowledgable, how polite, how helpful etc.
2. There are those people who book on trips who haven’t properly researched what they are paying for and think there are going to visit half a continent in 2 weeks and then get fed up most of the time is spent driving - that’s why they call it overlanding! When these people turn round and complain, about how they hate camping or long drives for example, then I have no time for them. Their complaints don’t belong on this site.
3. The Dragoman trip I went on, quite some time ago now as it was one of my first, met my expectations at the time. However, having been on several trips with other companies in the years since then I can say that Dragoman might be a reasonable operator overall, but pound for pound and like for like, they do seem to charge a considerable premium over their competitors. In the past this may have been justified, but with the major improvements made by competitors and increased competition in recent years, this no longer seems the case. It seems to me that Dragoman are trading on past glory, due to their long standing presence in the market, but apart from this there is little to justify the high prices in my view. However, if Joe Public is still willing to pay then why not charge high prices? Having said that, the last Drago truck I saw, whilst travelling independently as it happens, only had 2 passengers on board (that looked like a fun trip for them - hope those two got on!) so maybe many people do think they overcharge…
Fair question Alex….. and the answer will vary depending on which trip people book in the first place. For example; someone who came out to Africa and travelled the main routes on a 63 day trip from Uganda to South Africa, is not likely to come back for quite a while, if at all. These days the trend is to do shorter trips that fit into annual leave allowances - leaving more opportunity to come back.
As to whether they come back to overlanding as their preferred mode of travel…. some figures for you…
- 87% of our ‘off line’ enquiries and 14% of our ‘on line’ enquiries are generated from people whose friends/family/work mates have been overlanding and liked the sound of it so much they want to go too.
- 16% of total enquiries (on line and off) are from previous clients, (you will find that is incredibly high for niche market tourism), and 92% of them will confirm. (And that does not include the people who email me directly as they have my email address from a previous booking).
- 91.2% of feedback received from clients in regard to their trip is rated ‘good’ to ‘excellent’ (out of a scale of 5).
Obviously these figures are my company statistics and I can’t speak for tour operators or other companies as a whole but I would say that the trend is similar in most cases.
I hope that helps.
Hi Mike, as an ex Dragoman passenger in South America I would agree that the old trucks have character and they can go places which the newer trucks like Tucans could not. But in terms of comfort they have a great deal to be desired, long drive days were very hard indeed when the trucks were 3/4 full. However on one leg 3-4 weeks the truck was full and this made it an endurance event !!! Unacceptable for the price you pay - and if you consider the local transport was more comfortable and cheaper!
If on an operational level the old trucks have advantages then they should be run but with fewer passengers and little more time built in and then at least drivers and passengers would be happier.
Overlanding was an experience which on many occasions we enjoyed enormously but…Tania I wonder how many people who overland go again?
100% Mike P!!!
I can clarify the tacho thing for you too… Drago run them in Africa as company procedure I understand (good on them!). They are the only company that I am aware of that do. Tacho’s are not required by law in Africa although all companies running in the Middle East run tacho’s in the countries that require them, (ie: Turkey).
Can I risk my neck and add that most of these issues become ‘complaints’ because the expectations of the client could be incorrect, not enough research done, questions asked, forums read? If overlanding was as bad as it is laid out to be (above) it surely wouldn’t have been running 100’s of trucks for over 30 years with thousands of departure dates (one of my suppliers runs over 1100 dep’s per year by themselves with bums on seats every time!) if it was so terrible…. a sense of adventure, sense of humor and a ‘come what may’ face = one hell of a memorable time!
To take up some of these points.
I worked for 5 years as an overland driver. And no, not for Dragoman before you think Im here to back them up. It was for Af Trails.
Alot of what is being said here is not exclusive to Dragoman. They are problems for the Overland companies as a whole. Its just unfortunate that you have experienced them with that particular company.
1. One of you mentioned the driver being a drunk. Every company has drivers who are a bit too fond of the drink at times. This really is not solely a Dragoman problem. You will find this with every company. I know, Ive seen it for 5 years. You were just unfortunate that your driver that time was a ‘drunk’ as you put it.
2. One of you mentioned that you were lead to believe that the crew were ‘tour guides’. I just looked on the Drago website and at their brochure and find nothing to suggest they are ‘guides’. If a place visited is deemed that interesing often a local guide is provided. This is the case with all the maor overland companies I believe.
Local guides have years and years of knowledge and experience, more than a crew member will ever know in their short career as an overland driver, plus the companies are re-investing your money into local pockets to provide this service. All companies have a very high turnover of crew, most of whom are changing continents every year and satisfying their appetite for travelling to new destinations. It would be impossible for them to have the knowledge to credibly be called ‘a guide’. They know the basics, or should do at least…….but they are already a driver, mechanic, accountant, diplomat, and agony aunt….that is why they are called ‘leaders’, not guides.
3. Many mention ‘knackered’ old trucks. Well, I can tell you that I have helped fix a few Drago trucks over the years! Yes they are old, and that is the beauty of them. They are easy to work on and easy to fix. I much prefer them to those modern trucks, as do all the local ‘bush mechanics’. Even alot of the drivers say that yeah, Drago/Kumuka/Exods trucks are ld, but boy hen the shit hits the fan they would prefer one of those old Merc/Mann trucks than the nice shiney new modern beast they have. Those modern trucks are not suitable for alot of the trips what Dragoman do. They are heavy on the electrics, which is not suited for the dusty muddy damp off roading that Dragoman and others pride themselves on.
I also worked for Tucan in S America for a short while (very short while!)….the ENDLESS problems with electrics….endless problems…and the modern air sprung suspension…forget it. Its all nice and well on tarmac highway, but you will have serious problems if you take that thing off road for any length of time. Some of their trucks dont even have diff locks! I remember one of the Budget drivers (part of Tucan) had to ask the Kumuka driver to move his truck in a campsite…..why? Cos he didnt want to risk getting bogged in this muddy puddle as he didnt have a diff lock!! We’re bloody overlanders!
Same with Rotel Tours (didnt work for them but saw them on the road many times, often moaning about the electrics).
Though old, Drago/Exodus/Kumuka trucks are actually, to my mind, perfect for those real off road areas. Altiplano in S America, jungles of Cameroon, dirt roads in Mali like Dogon country, Tmbuktu etc etc….
4. Another complaint about Overland trucks….why arent they 4wd?? Listen, can we get this straight, 4wd in sand is really not much of an advantage. Believe me. I have driven 4wd and 2wd, and if anything it causes the wheels to dig in more. It is all about gettng the correct lower tyre pressures and keeping the momentum up to clear the sand. Only driver experience can get that right, it has little to do with the truck. That is a fact. Nobody can teach you this, it takes experience. Ive seen rusty old Citroens and Peugeots zoom through sand whilst Landcruisers get bogged….its all down to tyre pressure and speed….only experience teaches you that.
Hit deep soft sand and all vehicles get stuck, not just Kumuka, AF Trails and Drago trucks! Ive even seen a unimog get stuck in sand before, and those things are the rolls royce of the overlanding world!
Its all about driver experience, not having 4wd.
Agreed, in the mud 4wd does help, but if you assess the muddy stretch properly first a 2wd truck will get you through if you get the lock on in time. And if you do get stuck, WELL, isnt that what you are there for?? A bit of adventure, a bit of fun? Youre in Africa, get out and get dgging, its all part of the experience!
5. To my mind, and please correct me if i am wrong, Dragoman are the only company that require their drivers to run tachographs? Please correct me if I am wrong. They are limited, their crew tell me, to 90kmph.
So remember that. When you see a Tucan truck zooming past at 110kmph, bear that in mind. As a pax Id feel safer in a Kumuka or Drago truck pulling along at 90kmph than one of those 220horsepower Drifters/Tucan ‘buses’ doing 110kmph.
Why woud you want to fo faster than 80-90kmph anyway?? In Africa, Asia etc, anything can happen! You know how animals run out in front of you, kids the same, and as for other drivers…not to mention the countles police stops. Slowng a truck down is not like drivng your Vauxhall or Ford, it does take alot of time to slow it down safely. Bear that in mind. And there is always that hidden pothole ahead, sometimes big enough to break a spring or roll a truck over…..be sensible with speed, it is NOT a race to se which company gets to cap first, this is when accidents can and WILL happen. Tose old Drago trucks are fine, they do 80-90kmph…thats all you want believe me.
What I will say against them is that the more modern trucks come into their own on the hills. That is very true and this is where the older companies like Guerba and Kumuka and Drago struggle. They dont have the HP to get up there as quickly. That is when it can be demoralising for the pax…but he, quit maoning, gives you a chance to get that photo out the window as you hear the driver change down gear again and again!!
7. Smebody said the cooking was worse than my brother. Can Dragoman really be blamed for that? Im sure every company has had some bad cooks. If you knew how little these guys got paid you might realise why the food was bad.
8. Dragoman have now replaced all their A Frame tents with the modern dome style ents. I know, I saw one of the Drago boss’ in Africa recently and he offered to sell the old A Frames to me! No chance!
9. Somebody else mentioned a fridge problem. Hee hee, if only you guys knew. I have been on so many trucks and fridges are the biggest pain EVER. Believe me, it is not a Drago problem, it is a problem with many companies. They often need re-gassing, but finding an agent who can re-gas them is not easy…oten you are weeks away from somebody who can do it for you.
Just te thoughts of an ex-overland driver.
The moans you guys put up there……they are not Dragoman issues exclusively, they are issues for many of the Overland companies. Im not here to defend Dragoman, or Exodus (no longer operating), or umuka, or Tucan, or Af Trails…..just ant you punters to look at those coments in a balanced light.
Mike P
What a bunch of sharks, no f…ing way i would tell my worst enemy bout this lot sh.t lorry was crap driver a drunk whenever he could be and the cooking standard was worse than my brother. Watchout a rip off. 07856-453321 I had no luck when I tried to compain they had so many reasons and an offer of a discount on another trip, ha i would not go if they PAID ME forget it. James
Wow John you sound like you had as good a trip with them as I did! The truck I was on was certainly knackered. I was in South America with the for the Rio carnival and boy what a load of sh..t the woman from the uk office talked, she said that the trucks are rotated and brought back to the UK or something and that they were going to be changed or some such clap trap, excuses after excuses just like the driver and co driver on my trip. No way am I going with them again mind you the way the trucks and equipment is I should think they are going under anyway. Oh and by the way dont bother ringing to complain, guess what..excuses and yep more excuses!! CB
I travelled with Dragoman in 2006 in Africa and have to say that I didn’t think they lived up to the hype either. The crew were very personable and helpful (if a little too fond of a drink) but the standard of equipment did leave a great deal to be desired.
According to our crew, the truck we were on had been converted to an overland truck back in the 1980’s, and it showed! Although I have no complaints about the design of the truck (despite being 20 years old it still held its own in terms of the layout and alleged facilities), its condition was far from satisfactory. Please see below:
a) The engine had obviously been round the clock numerous times as it was vastly underpowered. We were overtaken on both the flat and hills by the newer trucks of several other overland companies (very demoralising on long drive days). Not only this but I know these companies to be cheaper than Dragoman! So why on earth was I paying a premium to travel in a knackered old truck???
As the crew pointed out the vehicle was regularly serviced by them (I did see them doing this) as per company regulations. However, if a vehicle’s engine has been round the clock so much that it is internally worn out, no amount of oil changes is going to bring it back to its old self. It would seem the premium I paid to Dragoman certainly wasn’t being invested in new trucks, although they had given it a nice new lick of paint in the new company colours recently. Note to Dragoman Head Office: Paint doesn’t make a truck work more reliably or go faster!
b) The fridge was totally unreliable. One of the reasons I paid the extra to go with Dragoman was for the fact their trucks had fridges, as it’s nice to have cool drinks and vegetables etc. However, it packed up on numerous occassions causing food to spoil and the truck to end up smelling of rotten meat. The crew said the fridge had been like that since they took the truck over several months beforehand and was down to a faulty motor. Dragoman head office had allegedlly told them they’d sort a new motor out and ship it to Cape Town, but despite the crew making this request several times (according to them), no action had been taken. If it had broken on the trip for the first time, then I’d be more forgiving, but several months to replace a part that you know is faulty, come on Dragoman! What was I paying for again???
c) Upon arriving at our designated camp sites we would often arrive to be greated by the trucks, tents and passengers of other overland companies. That’s right, the ones that had not only overtaken us earlier in the day, but had also had a lie-in that morning before getting up and overtaking us and then arriving well before us. This meant they were not only better slept, but also had the luxury of having eaten and washed up and hit the bar before we’d barely arrived at camp. I didn’t pay to Dragoman to get up at the crack of dawn, be stuck on a hot truck all day and then have the fact rubbed in my face by the passengers of other companies who’d paid less!!!
d) Did I mention the tents? All the other overland compaines we saw had lovely brand new South African-made two man dome tents that you could stand up in and were a breeze to put up. We were so jealous. We had to make to with old A-frame tents that looked and smelled like they were about 10 years old. Not only were they a fiddle to put up but they smelt musty due to the age and the number of people who had slept in them over the years. The crew said they did clean them at the end of each trip (I saw this too) but no amount of cleaning will ever truely get out the built-in grime of years of use. The crew did say that they had pointed this out to head office as a regular complaint from passengers. Well why was no action taken? What is Drago doing with all the extra money its clients are paying!!! If the other companies have new tents then why don’t you??? How difficult can it be to buy some new tents???
One final complaint is that Dragoman sell their trips as being lead by experienced tour guides. As the crew pointed out to us on numerous occassions, they were actually employed as ‘leaders’ not ‘guides’ and the two are very different things. They told us a ‘leader’ is responsible for ensuring the trip and truck run smoothly whereas a ‘guide’ is someone with a great deal of local knowledge. The crew did exhibit a pretty good knowledge of many things and places we went to and saw, but they had their limitations as they were not ‘trained guides’ as I was lead to believe. This meant we were often left wanting for further explantion of many of the things we saw. I was lead to believe I was paying for ‘guides’ who had all the answers, but I was mislead.
In summary, had I not paid the premium to travel with Dragoman I would I would have been far happier with things. I just can’t see how they justify it based on the experience I had. I don’t know if things are getting any better since I travelled with them. If things are the same as when I went, it would seem all you’re going to get for the premium they charge is the nice smell of all that fresh paint they put on all their old trucks to make them look much better than they really are!!!
Hi Alexianna & Steve,
Sorry to hear that your trips weren’t what you expected. I left Dragoman 3 years ago. Just a suggestion: contact them with what you were not happy with, that gives them a chance to explain their side of the story. Alexianna - hope South America did live up to your expectations though? Did you do the Inca Trail? I nearly died getting up to Dead Woman’s pass but the view from the sungate made it all worth it, didn’t it?
Cheers - Claudia
Hi Claudia, it is good to have a view from an insider but I am not sure how many years ago you worked with them - things have changed!
How can anyone sort out any problem that comes up in the middle of nowhere? There was no mobile phone provided, no GPS for positioning not even an updated road map (!!) We spend many, many hours back and forth trying to find the correct route and had to rely to passangers’ maps for directions. There was no backup in the sense that you imply and the one provided certainly does not justify the cost. Out of date trip notes also made the trip a bit more difficult, which is a type of support that you also expect if you are paying a premium. I could go on and on about Dragoman’s performance on an organisational level ( I spend 4 months travelling around S.america) but that should not reflect back on the fantastic (and sometimes impossible) tasks the drivers are left to do!!!
Having been on a dragoman trip I found it hard to justify to myself the high cost considering your kitty practically covers your cost on the trip such as camping hotels food etc. So what you pay before you leave is transportation equipment and drivers. All the drivers we talked to said it certainly wasnt going on their salaries, I would be very surprised if the difference could be attributed to insurance.
On backup we certainly felt that the company relied heavily on there crew and did not provide the support that you would expect. Basic things like road maps, guide books or up to date notes were not available. Considering the number of times these trucks travel through the area you would expect some detailed information.
Luckily we did not have any major mechanical problem - well nothing the crew could nt fix - so that backup support was never needed but considering how details were not included I wonder how well they would have coped with a major problem.
A bit of news from an insider: I worked for Dragoman for several years and yes, some of their tours are more expensive than other operators’. However, when things go wrong, they sort it all out properly. Thousands of GBP are being spent every year on the right insurance, and it pays off. If they have a breakdown, they do provide the back-up, not like other companies where the crew are just left to deal with it all themselves (I worked for other companies too).
If you’re not happy with something on your trip, I’d suggest contacting their office in the UK and you’ll get a personal reply straight away. Alternatively ask them for some of their clients’ email addresses so that you can get unbiased advice from people that have travelled with them.